Young photojournalist detained for army cadet pics

Not again?

I do not know what worries me most about this report.

is it the fact that a journalist, someone who has clearly identified himself as such, is being detained, and hassled for no good reason.

Or should I be more concerned because of what appears to be the complete ignorance of the police personnel, and lack of knowledge of the law they are trying to use whilst doing so?

Sunny SA

Move to sunny South Africa. The weather is better, we're past such draconian laws and terrorism fears, and after this weekend there are no more soccer fans around.

A symptom of serious training failures

On a day when the armed forces were supposed to be showing themselves to the public in a positive light, this sends entirely the wrong (though not necessarily incorrect) message about the relationship between the British state and the public.

Beyond the freedom of expression and freedom of movement issues, what's going on here is that a police officer is simply inventing law ("when it comes to children you need signed parental consent to photograph"; "it is a criminal offence to photograph a police officer") and citing it as justification for obstructing lawful activity and reporting.

Unless there are disciplinary consequences, it's easy to see how officers can slip into a kind of fantasy world where anything that strikes them as dodgy is assumed to be illegal, and devil take the detail. I suspect a lot more of this goes on unseen in less educated communities - and is perhaps an even greater threat to freedom than impeding photographers.

From this and other incidents, it seems clear that officers are specifically trained not to respond to requests to explain the legal basis for their actions. That really isn't good enough.

Police bullying

What we don't see is how the photographer was acting. However, from the recording onwards we do. And, it's worse.

To me this really sounded like a police officer saw a "young" photographer then decided to shove his power crazed weight around.

His colleagues backed him up, and they tried to intimidate the photographer.

They changed approach several times.

The U.K. Police force are becoming a disgrace.

Actually this has been going on too long, they already are. Shame on the UK, shame on you.

When will this stop?

The officers' involved in this MUST be disciplined. Mattson reapeateddly asked what he was doing wrong, and wehn told nothing asked to carry on with his business and was told he could not, He asked again why, and was never given an answer. In the end he was arrested because "of the anxiety caused to members of the public"? Poppycock!
Police officers need to be reminded that they are instruments of the law, and exist to enforce the laws enacted by parliament. It is not for them to make up the law, ever. The only "anxiety" in this case was that the officer has no bloody idea whay he was doing.
I hope Mattson sues.

Photography is not a crime.

Heavy-handed and totally out-of-context to the supposed 'terrorism' threat (which the police alluded to) at the event. George Orwell's '1984' is beginning to become fact.

Taking photos is potentially a crime? What a farce!

Get a claim in

Simple as that. Get a claim in, sit back and expect a pay out of around £3K

European human Rights Act 2008, freedom of Expression.

Losing trust

I don't think the police or the government realise how dangerous this kind of behaviour is. The public will lose trust assuming that all are power-crazed bullies wanting to record your DNA on a database.

Once this trust is lost solving crimes will become so much harder. We've seen what happens with gang-related murders, and the unwillingness of people to come forward. This kind of attitude will spread and the police will have a hard time getting any witnesses for any crime.

The real risk?

As an ex serviceman who was regularly part of public parades and would be fully expected to be photographed by journalists and members of public alike. Taking photographs does not in anyway constitute a risk to security or a possible act of terrorism. What does constitute a risk to security is when a number of police officers who should be be looking out for suspicious items and known targets appear to be all concentrating on trying to bully a photographer.

The police escalated this incident from what appears to be their inability to back down and lack of knowledege of the law. The use of anti terrorism legislation in this case was a disgrace for which they should be ashamed of and I hope an enquiry is held into this matter.

Inspector John Fisher - making laws up while u wait!

What a shower of bullying imbeciles!

It was like they were going for the record in citing the most made-up or irrelevant laws in the shortest time possible.

Hope you get justice on this.

Cadets gave permission

All Cadet Forces get parental consent to photographs (taken & published) whilst "on Duty or Assignment" (not just once but almost every time they are 'parading publicly') - I have done this many times in past for my son (as an Army Cadet Band Member) & also my parents did this in the past when I was a Air Cadet

Never mind the fact that its a public place so permission is NOT Required

Further thought

After further thought on this matter is not the policeman we hear and see, and all those others involved in this incident guilty of 'causing an obstruction', the very law that is cited to photographers when Police persons can't think of anything better to justify their actions.

Interfering with a member of the public going about his lawful business is no longer something that should be taken so lightly and treated so cavalierly by the Police, whichever force they belong to,.

It really is about time Police training was hiked up a notch or two, and raised awareness was applied to policing in the street.

Agree, and keen to help

I agree entirely - this is a disgrace - Big Brother Watch is keen to help

http://www.bigbrotherwatch.org.uk/home/2010/06/unbelievably-photographers-are-still-being-abused-by-the-police-for-exercising-basic-rights.html

Community policing at it's best....

Bullying and ignorant police officers...very sad state of affairs.

True Colours Shining Through

This once again is Police bulling and harassment by the ignorant and pig headed members of the police force today. I have been stopped twice in the past few months with the most flimsy excuses that they can think of at the time. We are photographers Not terrorists.

Things to do...

Sadly this is nothing new, had it all through my career. Yet even when the photographer is trying very hard to do his part the right way, calm and assertive, he can not get the Officer to see reason. It seems the Police had decided his face did not fit, there is no excuse for them obstructing the photographer, assaulting him by grabbing his camera or pushing him, how would the CPS justify such?

Also why did the Police have a problem with the situation being recorded?

There are things to do in such situations, the first thing is to get notice out of the immediate officer or two. Ask them to call their commanding officer for advice, yes it works, tell them other officers have been disciplined for this behaviour. If your a working media photographer, call you desk or the Police press office, you could even call 999 and request assistance fearing the officers actions.

If you see it happen to another photographer, get close so you can observe, photograph or video the situation. Additionally if you see a senior officer get them involved.

As photographers we should not stand by, several times I have turned my camera on a colleague being harassed by an officer to see the Police withdraw, the same has been true in reverse. I asked an officer to clearly state his name rank and number for the tv crew's microphone, he vanished and I thanked the crew.

Taking a longer view, maybe the NUJ should make representations to the Police Federation, this is a professional standards issue. An issue that is beginning to undermine the Police in a large group of the population, we have a great Police force and should not let a few misguided incidents damage their reputation. Time the Police understood the only thing to fear from a camera is when they are breaking the law.

Police just say and do what they like

What disgusts me about these incidents is the it's the Police who always create a scene, then cite 'public order' reasons to detain a photographer.

It seems to come so easily to them. How often do they use these tactics on other members of the public?

Outrageous!

I just find this despicable and outrageous these officers should be arrested themselves. Little more than Thugs! Ranting on about children because they know what a pathetic brainwashed society we have become educated by hysteria like that. It is a DISGRACE to live in this Country under laws and politics as low as this! Why did we bother fighting the Nazi's ...this is no different!

Oh the bare-faced cheek!

'The spokeswoman for the Metropolitan Police Service has now issued a statement to BJP: "It is clearly not the intention of the MPS to prevent people from taking photographs...'

That woman has some chutzpah! Quite clearly it was the intention of the MPS officers there to prevent someone from taking photographs, and with no basis in law.

Kids at war

So, since when does the UK send children to war? What a bullsh*t argument, "taking pictures of children". Ridiculous!

IPCC

The photographer should refer this to the IPCC,

they a: assaulted him by pushing him down the stairs.
b: pretty much kidnapped him (or at least falsely imprisoned him) and
c: have no idea what the hell they are doing so how on earth could jackbooted thugs like that be in a position to deal with a real terrorist incident, or even a real terrorist.. Let alone the myriad of other delicate things the police get called to investigate..

Use the form here:-
http://www.ipcc.gov.uk/index/complaints/forms/form_complaint.htm

Yes, they just forward it on to the internal investigations team of the force in question but it's come from the IPCC, so there's a much better chance of them reading it and taking it seriously if they are involved..

Asault

The Met now are assaulting children, what next?

Powerkick!

It really isn't hard to see why this happened. A 15 year old is an easy target for a power mad "officer of the Law" and I use that term very loosely.

What amazes me is that there was more than one involved in this incident! I can't believe none of the officers involved had the common sense to realise they were acting outside their own powers and were displaying their own ignorance of the laws they are paid to uphold. Or were they? More likely the case was that they chose to ignore the wrong they were doing as they thought it would never come to light and anyway who would take the word of a 15 year old youth over theirs? How nice it is to see that it has backfired on them and has been brought to the public's and their senior officer's attention.

How small and insignificant do these officers feel now? Outsmarted by what they thought would be an easy target.

Were there any adult photographers in attendance? Did they also receive the same treatment? I suspect not.

I really hope the lad makes a complaint and sues the Met, it's high time this stopped, and that will only happen if enough people follow things through to the end and make proper complaints and bring it to the attention of the senior officers and the public.

I have been stopped by officers in my area, Gateshead and Newcastle, while covering media events and have to say I have never had any problems, it would seem that the officers in this part of the UK seem to have been educated on the law properly, maybe the Met should think about sending their officers up here for training!

Then they wonder why people don't trust them??

I believe the correct acronym is, A.C.A.B.

Self-control

Apart from the obvious anger that I share with you all in reading and listening to this, the thing that strikes me most about the recording is how amazingly self-controlled Jules Mattsson remains throughout this. I think that many of us might struggle to retain such composure. All credit to him for doing so as his calm and reasoned actions and words only help to further put to shame those against whom he is pitted. We have all had enough of this and it is time for disciplinary or even legal action against officers displaying this level or ignorance and mis-use of the law.

Not again?

I would like to say that this is shocking, disgusting, incredible etc since this is, (surely?) an isolated incident. But as a lot of the comments have pointed out, it unfortunately seems to be quite common nowadays. I am currently pursuing a claim against the police which has, so far, resulted in 1 complaint to the Independent Police Complaints Commission (upheld). Upon receipt of this they are legally obliged to implement a full formal investigation. Months have passed with little being done - why? - according to them they did not realise that they had to do anything! Is this lack of training, ignorance or simply the fact that they don't really care about the communities they are supposed to be protecting (and who also fund their salaries can I just point out)? I would love to be able to say that this is (obviously) an isolated incident but, when coupled with the latest episode of them going round harassing young photographers, it does kind of make you think..

One word

Kafkaesque!

Time to go Trafalgar Square again?

I get the sense that our last protest in January hasn't changed a bloody thing. This coppers are a bloody disgrace to their uniform.

Oh and by the way....

Sue the bastards. It's the only way they will learn. Hit em where it hurts. In the pocket....

Shameful

Our police are really becoming a laughing stock. The officers involved in this incident do not deserve to wear the uniform or claim to uphold the law. I hope this photographer does get a claim in, it's just a pity the payout won't come from this officers bloated pension pot that I helped fund.

Double Standards

With all the re-runs of Police, Camera, Action and other revenue-raising tv shows you regularly hear the Police officers telling suspects that they are legally allowed to film the stopping, questioning and arrest in public.
So why then do they then turn around and not let members of the public do the same?

mental midgets in size 14 boots

I'm all for hiring the handicap but maybe it's not such a good idea to let the mentally challenged become police officers. If you can not articulate a reasonable understanding of the laws you are supposedly there to enforce you have no right pretending to be a cop. There are reasons for dumbing down the police forces. It is happening in the UK as well as here in the US. They are dumber and more violent. Most importantly they are less likely to be guided by good conscience when their superiors order them to smash heads to protect their masters. After all history shows time and time again that the ruling class can only rule in decadence for so long before the deprived underclass snatches it all away from them. They are just preparing for the inevitable.

Mixed Priorities?

Sadly the police seem to be of the opinion that they are there to serve the the Law. They have to realise they are there to serve the public and apply the law only in the interests of the public.
This sort of behaviour wouldn`t be tolerated from any other public employee.
Masters or servants?. We decide not them!!

And again...

The last government implemented a police state. I just hope this one will dismantle it as quick as possible. Id just like to commend the victim, he held his ground and showed up the incompetence of the police.

Agree with JoJo

Hi JoJo,

Can't agree more. My international courier has been booked and the plane plane tickets paid for. Roll on sunny SA - only a few months to go!! While not perfect, the police there spend their time chasing real criminals and don't give photographers a second thought. Once upon a time England used to champion our freedoms but now, sadly, they want to control our thoughts. How ironic that many so called third world countries now offer the freedoms that the west surrendered long ago. I'm an ex - police officer (from another country) and we hate having our incompetence and lack of knowledge of the law exposed. That's why the officer changed his reason for "detention" from illegal photography to breach of the peace. You can see/hear it in all the videos and audio recordings of these events online. A police officer asks a photographer what he is doing, the photographer replies saying that he's taking photos, the police officer asks to see identification, you politely decline and then this is where it all goes pear shaped. The law says you DO NOT have to give your details unless you have been detained. The police hate people who know and exercise their rights. So now the policeman is going to "make you pay." The officer absolutely knows that you are not a terrorist but he's going to do all he can to now detain and inconvenience you because you had the audacity to stand upon the law which police somehow think is only their divine right to do. The police are used to being obeyed at all times so when you refuse to give your details or to show them your photos they look for other ways to circumnavigate your right to refuse. That's when they move on quoting you are breaching the peace. Many police officers actually lie about the law (as is evidenced in the recording above) knowing that 99% of the public don't know any better and won't question them. I'm not anti - police but I just don't understand their current conduct in this regard. Unfortuantely many police officers think they ARE the law rather than normal people who are paid to UPHOLD the law.

Sing with me...Leaving on a jet plane - knowing I won't be back again...

PS: JoJo, wanna meet up in Cape Town sometime?

I've got an idea

Mr Cameron says he's open to suggestions that will save public money.

How about firing bent coppers, rather than allowing them to retire on "health grounds" with a full pension when they know they've been banged to rights?

What you forget

What you forget is that the British police, along with many police forces around the world, are target related and they need to meet certain quotas, be they completion rate, arrest rate, recruitment amongst ethnic groups rated, and so on. It's not just the UK police, it's all police everywhere. Many of them are good people, but many of them are there because it's a job, and many of them are there because it's an excuse.

Send him to jail!

He is neither an adult nor was he authorized by the proper authorities to act in a journalistic manner. He should have been at home, studying!

Police Camera Shows

How often have I watched Road Wars or Police Camera Action and the person being stopped complains about being filmed and the police officer knowingly states that it is a public place and they are legally able to film.
Hypocrisy!

And so it goes...

The last two times I went to the UK, I had multiple unpleasant run-ins with police who were clearly making up laws on the spot and was even threatened with being put on a watch list which would keep me banned from entering the country ever again.

One exchange that happened (Trafalgar Square):
"What are you doing here?"
I'm videotaping this fountain."
"The fountain?"
"Yes, this enormous thing directly in front of the lens, do you want to look through the viewfinder?"
"Some people come here to videotape the girls in the square."
"As far as I'm aware that's not illegal but in any case, I'm clearly capturing images of the fountain."
"Well, you'll have to stop and leave, otherwise..."
"?..."

The UK used to be such a friendly and hospitable place but "preventing terrorism" has become an excuse for strong-arming obvious (and clearly benign) targets because it's easy. It gives the illusion of protection while only actually serving to hassle the very public they are supposedly protecting.

Millions died in WW2 to defeat the Nazi's.

What is going on? Did those officers have grandparents or great-grandparents that fought the Nazis? If so, they would have had a better understanding of what Freedom is. Those officers need to be fired for incompetence, and go to work in a job that doesn't require an education, and common sense wouldn't be needed either.

Morons

Ignorant, bullying morons.

Police Brutality

I for one am in favour of the reduction of police officers as they are no longer upholding the law, but provoking disquiet. They appear to lack knowledge of the law and conjour up laws to suit themselves. Let them get a real job.

What ignorance!

The ignorance and arrogance of the police is unbelievable, they were making up charges as they went along.

Well done to the young photographer for standing up to such thuggish jobsworths.

Heavy Tactics

This has happened to me on a number of occasions. I have been stopped by police, parents and security guards all demanding that I have no right to take photos. I have had people demand that I remove their images form my camera when I was taking photos of street views. I walked onto a public park where a cricket match was taking place. I took some generic long distance shots for some magazine work. A parent cam over and basically stopped short of labeling me as a pervert. I was grabbed three times at a festival having been accused of taking photographs of YES, PEOPLE' The irony of this was that the festival organisers had granted me unrestricted access to all areas. The goons descended on me as if I were about to detonate a bomb. They told me to delete my images. Suffice to say that I asked to be taken to their leader who was more than happy to release me back to the wilds. This film is worrying to me as i rely on freelance editorial work for a living. Photographers should support each other but in my experience many are too precious and teritorial and basically don't give a f**k about their fellow photographers.

Bad police

Having had this sort of nonsense, I agree with everything written here. A thorough understanding of the law and our rights is imperative. A good point is to sue: with damages of around £3K oe more, I'm looking forward to being stopped, refuse to give my details and hopefully locked in a cell for a ew hours. I'm in need of a couple of weeks on Corfu. Tempted to bring a private prosecution but know that CPS would stop it as 'not in the public interest.' You should not be surprised to see that the Force supports the officer - the Professional Standards Department investigates and produces a whitewash of a report that states that the officer was right to be concerned/duty to investigate complaints made by a 'concerned member of the public' and will include much criticism of you. This is what happened to me 4 years ago. Publicity is the key.

Time to be sure your voice is heard

The Coalition Government's Your Freedom site has an entry on this:

http://yourfreedom.hmg.gov.uk/repealing-unnecessary-laws/taking-photographs-of-a-police-officer

Provoking Young Kid

I see a young kid provoking the police by continually photographing in their faces.

Yes... and no. Both parties were at fault here.

While this sounds suspect, and the photographer does have a right to take photos, AND the police have acted improperly, he acted in a manner which I can understand irrated the police.

Polite conversation and a little common sense would have saved a lot of hassle.

One thing that did annoy me, if an undercover police officer asks not to be photographed to protect his identity, grow up and respect his request. Don’t roll of silly quotes about law.

There needs to be give and take in these situations. Photographers are acting "like they own place". I'm a photographer. I sympathise, but this was not the way to handle the police.

I was there

This young idiot gives a very one sided view of events and ironically does't post onto youtube the beginning of the conversation, where he deliberatley provokes the police officer taking pictures inches from his face.
The facts are, the narrow area where the parade was forming up was being congested and all members of the public where being kept out of the form up area, not just this boy. My parents tried to reach me in this area and was told the area was cordened off for safety and security reasons. Mainly I suspect as there were armed soldiers about to parade from the Royal Anglian Regiment and young cadets and bands there and it was becoming very congested.
My parent tried to reach me in the cordened area (i was in uniform with my youth group) but were prevented by officers and rightly so. Being law abiding people they moved back and didn't make a scene.
The boy was an irritant to all concerned and the police officer was firm, but courteous.
I would hapily give evidence against this obvious agitator and felt that the officer was at all time professional.

Above the law

Listen to the policeman at 1:00 - 1:03minutes. When asked under what law he was interrogating the photographer, he quite clearly says, "... don't have to have any law ..."

So that's the view of the british police is it? Above the law?

No surprises there.

Incredible ignorance demonstrated by this police officer

An appalling and outrageous example of ignorance by the officers involved and a clear example of why some individuals are unsuitable to be police officers. Never heard so much tosh!, this clearly demonstrates an dim individual who clearly does not know his law and yet purports to uphold it. Fortunately, not all officers are absent of common sense and reasoning. Surprised that another police officer did not see fit to intervene. Some police officers forget that they are public servants, they do not have the right to act outside of the law though clearly some "mutton heads", will never understand the difference and should be removed. As is said, "Ignorance of the law is not excuse". This sort of conduct only leads to resentment and distaste for the police which, unfortunately, lowers their credibility and authority and undermines the efforts of good officers.

Constable Savage

I am reminded of the Rowan Atkinson sketch Constabe Savage. Look, clearly a person holding a camera and taking a photograph is an enamy of the state because we all know that terrorists take photos and then argue their rights with police. Again, clearly this 15 year old should have known better than to photograph anything in England as England has been declared a no photo zone. These police were highly stressed as I am suere that all would agree that dealing with 15 year old photographers would be highly streesful not to mention the taking of photos of police. I think all would be shocked by a person taking a photo in a public place. Who does this 15 year old think he is or more importantly, where does he think he is, in a democracy?

Constable Savage

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BO8EpfyCG2Y

Frightning

This only makes me more frightened of the police and makes me trust them less and less. If they had nothing to hide they wouldn't be worried about photographers. But their actions at recent demonstrations show they cannot be trusted.

Better for photographers to travel in groups and carry recording equipment to catch the police exceeding their authority.

Terrorism Laws?

Terrorism Laws? Oh, not that ol' chestnut... Pictures of kids? Cop has now reached the extent of his imagination.

This young man is smarter than the 4 of these goons combined, and puts the UK police force to shame, absolute shame.